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May 29 (Reuters) - A senior member of a Russian think tank whose ideas sometimes become government policy has suggested Moscow consider a "demonstrative" nuclear explosion to cow the West into refusing to allow Ukraine to use its arms against targets inside Russia.

The proposal, opens new tab, by Dmitry Suslov, a member of the Moscow-based Council for Foreign and Defence Policy, was issued a day after President Vladimir Putin warned the West that NATO members in Europe were playing with fire by proposing to let Kyiv use Western weapons to strike deep inside Russia, something he said could trigger a global conflict.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/think-tank-close-kremlin-says-russia-should-consider-demonstrative-nuclear-2024-05-29/

A Russian think tank has suggested that the government demonstrate its nuclear weapons in the open air to warn the West from escalating the conflict in Ukraine. I was wondering if there's any treaty Russia is a part of that forbids the use of nuclear weapons in open air even if it's not against another country.

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    Your heading is wrong. This would not be a "non-military purpose". A test is probably also a military purpose, unless done purely for scientific research with no plans to make a weapon.
    – Stuart F
    Commented Jun 3 at 15:30
  • @StuartF: indeed, during some of the US testing, much was made of the distinction. youtube.com/watch?v=Qe4UZK3_FiU Commented Jun 3 at 15:34
  • @StuartF Usage of nuclear detonations was considered throughout the 50-60s for mining or civil engineering purposes. Commented Jun 3 at 21:14
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    As i understand, "forbid" is not a correct word to international treaties, "prohibit" is must be. Commented Jun 4 at 1:50

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Undoubtedly, since Russia is a signatory to the 1963 Partial Test Ban Treaty

The Partial Test Ban Treaty (PTBT), formally known as the 1963 Treaty Banning Nuclear Weapon Tests in the Atmosphere, in Outer Space and Under Water, prohibited all test detonations of nuclear weapons except for those conducted underground.

First, let's look at what was said by the think tank gentleman:

it is worth considering conducting a demonstration (that is, not a combat) nuclear explosion. The political and psychological effect of the nuclear mushroom, which will be shown live on all television channels in the world, will hopefully return to Western politicians the only thing that prevented wars between the great powers after 1945 and that they have now largely lost, – fear of nuclear war.

A "nuclear mushroom" means an open air detonation. Not an underground one, which are more debatable.

So, why is an open air explosion an issue? Because Russia inherited the USSR's treaty obligation from 1963 banning tests and any other nuclear explosions in the atmosphere:

TREATY banning nuclear weapon tests in the atmosphere, in outer space and under water

The Governments of the United States of America, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, and the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, hereinafter referred to as the "Original Parties,"

...

Article I

  1. Each of the Parties to this Treaty undertakes to prohibit, to prevent, and not to carry out any nuclear weapon test explosion, or any other nuclear explosion, at any place under its jurisdiction or control:

(a) in the atmosphere; beyond its limits, including outer space; or under water, including territorial waters or high seas; or (b) in any other environment if such explosion causes radioactive debris to be present outside the territorial limits of the State under whose jurisdiction or control such explosion is conducted. It is understood in this connection that the provisions of this subparagraph are without prejudice to the conclusion of a Treaty resulting in the permanent banning of all nuclear test explosions, including all such explosions underground, the conclusion of which, as the Parties have stated in the Preamble to this Treaty, they seek to achieve.

Now, bear in mind that this type of saber-rattling is hardly new with Russia since 2022. Nor fantasizing about nuke usage limited to Russia. But, yes, it is symptomatic of Putin's Russia that no one seems to bat an eye at these kinds of rants.

However, bear in mind also that actually carrying out such a demonstration could create more problems than it would solve for Russia: because NATO may choose to carry on as before and because of the potential for extreme disapproval by even nations that have been neutral wrt the "special military operation". So this type of officially-deniable (more exactly Russian officials can distance themselves) public-consumption threats seems more likely to be done or tolerated for psychological/diplomacy reasons than with actual intent to carry through. They may also serve to make Putin appear more reasonable than "alternative Russian policymakers" by normalizing the current level of Russian aggression.

Most certainly, in today's tightly-censored Russia, those remarks are intended to happen by those in power.


To give a little bit of context to the saber-rattling, let's look at the latest coverage of what Putin had to say:

BBC June 7

Mr Karaganov is a hawkish Russian foreign policy expert. Last year he called for a pre-emptive nuclear strike. Today he suggested holding a “nuclear pistol” to the temple of the West over Ukraine.

And Mr. Karaganov is not, in fact, merely talking about a nuclear demo. No sirree.

A Difficult but Necessary Decision

Thing may also get to the point when we will have to urge our compatriots and all people of goodwill to leave their places of residence near facilities that may become targets for strikes in countries that provide direct support to the puppet regime in Kiev. The enemy must know that we are ready to deliver a preemptive strike in retaliation for all of its current and past acts of aggression in order to prevent a slide into global thermonuclear war.

But what if they (note: the West) do not back down? What if they have lost the instinct of self-preservation completely? In this case we will have to hit a bunch of targets in a number of countries in order to bring those who have lost their mind to reason.

Yup, that is what the eminently reasonable "leading public foreign policy organization" in Russia has to say these days.

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  • But, they have a point. Nuclear weapons HAD prevented global wars since WW2. And the west seems to have forgotten than. I mean, a few weeks ago Ukraine destroyed early detection system deep in the Russian territory. Since that is a crutial component of the MAD doctrine such an attack is insanity.
    – Negdo
    Commented Jun 12 at 9:57
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There were attempts to have a ban on nuclear explosion tests. Unfortunately all 44 countries using nuclear technology have to ratify it and as of right now only 41 have signed and only 35 have ratified it. So it's not yet in effect. Russia ratified but later withdraw from the treaty.

That being said dropping a nuclear bomb not even as test, but as intimidation could easily be seen as an act of war. If it's too close to another country or if the fallout hits another country or just to curb this because it's very dangerous bullshit. So that would be a major escalation with unforeseeable consequences up to WWIII apart from Russia presumably doing that by bombing their own country, which... you know is stupid...

Edit: Also the UK, U.S. and the Soviet Union already had a ban on arms testing, which I presume Russia has inherited: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partial_Nuclear_Test_Ban_Treaty So TL;DR Yes there is such a treaty.

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In short.

Nukes tests prohibited by Treaty of 1963, called "Moscow Treaty". The Treaty prohibits tests in open air, cosmic and water sides. But not underground. And the US for example used this part of Treaty to went aside.

In 1996 there was tries to create the New Treaty of Full Test Prohibition(underground also), but in spite of the US was initiators, they didn't ratify it. So the New Treaty not become world one.

The third try of the Ban All Nukes was initiated by Britain at 21-06-2022, but that was not supported at all by Russia because of the Ukraine conflict, but also even by the US.

So.

There are no treaties that prohibiting the explosions of nukes in open air if it is not a test.

About some illusions.

If the West weapons will become to use by the Ukraine militaries on Russia pre-conflict territory - Ukraine lost it's chance for "self-defence" position. Ukraine become the offence side. And all the states that send the weapons that used for aggression on Russian territory will become the sides of the conflict, with all following consequences.

That mean WW3 that is why in this escalation stage Russia may to use a nuke hanabi for the calming the west war heads. Ofc not on Russian territory, in the North, probably, or under EU~

Because WW3 will be 99,9% a nuke one.

So that is the Russian creative stop the war theoretically action, proposed by Karaganov, i think. Russia is trying to hint that it is very bad idea to use the West military stuff on Russian territory, by "Ukrainians" or not, nvm.

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    You claim: "There are no treaties that prohibiting the explosions of nukes in open air if it is not a test." Not true, all air nuclear explosions are banned under 1963 treaty : "or any other nuclear explo sion, at any place under its jurisdiction or control :" That's the exact, short, full text, easily readable at UN archives. It gives no leeway for "creative interpretations" under which such a test would not break treaty commitments. Commented Jun 4 at 5:51
  • @ItalianPhilosophers4Monica the Treaty named "nukes test", not another. The Treaty not prohibit usage if it will be defensive sense action. If NATO-the-west weapons will attack Russian territory it will be aggression against Russia, and Russia will use UN self-defence principle.Self-defence>>test Commented Jun 4 at 11:20

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